{"id":37480,"date":"2025-07-14T11:55:07","date_gmt":"2025-07-14T08:55:07","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/when.org.gr\/?p=37480"},"modified":"2026-04-21T17:22:02","modified_gmt":"2026-04-21T14:22:02","slug":"what-does-it-mean-to-care-and-why-doesnt-it-fit-in-our-work","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/when.org.gr\/en\/what-does-it-mean-to-care-and-why-doesnt-it-fit-in-our-work\/","title":{"rendered":"What does it mean to care - and why doesn\u2019t it \u201cfit\u201d in our work?"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<div class=\"text\">\n    <h6><b>What does it mean to care &#8211; and why doesn\u2019t it \u201cfit\u201d in our work? <\/b><\/h6>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This podcast episode is dedicated to care &#8211; a word with many different meanings, especially when it comes to work and daily life. How does the <strong>unequal distribution<\/strong> of caregiving responsibilities affect the lives of caregivers? What does it mean for women to be consistently present in the role of <strong>informal caregivers<\/strong>, and what is the role of men in this landscape?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Our guest is <strong>Dimitra Gounari, PCI Parent Coach\u00ae | Creating Supportive Workplaces for Parents<\/strong>, a voice with long-standing experience in the field. <strong>Pinelopi Theodorakakou<\/strong>, Co-founder of WHEN \/ inc.lude, speaks with her about the need to recognise individuals with caregiving responsibilities, the <strong>mental and financial burden<\/strong> this role often entails, and why increasing men&#8217;s participation is not a luxury, but a prerequisite for equality, sustainability, and prevention.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The second episode of &#8220;WHEN on Topic&#8221;, which is implemented as a part of the <a href=\"https:\/\/when.org.gr\/en\/caredizo-care-is-everyones-responsibility\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">CAREdiZo<\/a> program, explores questions such as:\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">How do we <strong>understand<\/strong> care today, and why is it so difficult to integrate it into our professional lives?\u00a0<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Why is care often considered <strong>&#8220;invisible&#8221;<\/strong> work?\u00a0<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">What are the practical <strong>consequences<\/strong> for women who take on caregiving roles?\u00a0<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">What do we <strong>lose<\/strong> when we fail to support working individuals with caregiving responsibilities?\u00a0<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">What does it mean to <strong>cultivate<\/strong> a culture of care within our organisations in ways that go beyond placing the burden solely on individual responsibility?<\/span><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Starting with\u00a0 a simple question- \u201cDo you have, or might you have, caregiving responsibilities?\u201d, we explore how we can build meaningful <strong>policies<\/strong>, not just informal &#8220;accommodations&#8221;, so that everyone can be seen and acknowledged within the circle of care.<\/span><\/p>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-embed is-type-rich is-provider-spotify wp-block-embed-spotify wp-embed-aspect-21-9 wp-has-aspect-ratio\"><div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n<iframe title=\"Spotify Embed: WHEN on Topic: \u03a4\u03b9 \u03c3\u03b7\u03bc\u03b1\u03af\u03bd\u03b5\u03b9 \u03bd\u03b1 \u03c6\u03c1\u03bf\u03bd\u03c4\u03af\u03b6\u03bf\u03c5\u03bc\u03b5 \u2013 \u03ba\u03b1\u03b9 \u03b3\u03b9\u03b1\u03c4\u03af \u03b4\u03b5\u03bd \u201c\u03c7\u03c9\u03c1\u03ac\u03b5\u03b9\u201d \u03c3\u03c4\u03b7 \u03b4\u03bf\u03c5\u03bb\u03b5\u03b9\u03ac \u03bc\u03b1\u03c2;\" style=\"border-radius: 12px\" width=\"100%\" height=\"152\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen allow=\"autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; fullscreen; picture-in-picture\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/embed\/episode\/1RKPvFrp2r6YlLk7JJXvjt?go=1&sp_cid=51cfa475821b6c604c153415e947866c&utm_source=oembed&utm_medium=desktop\"><\/iframe>\n<\/div><\/figure>\n\n\n<section id=\"nvm-faq-block_62e6e03609bdc74ff1682eeb0bd027aa\" class=\"nvm-faq alignfull\">\r\n    <div class=\"panel panel-width-normal\">\r\n        <div class=\"row small-align-self-center\">\r\n                                        <div class=\"small-column-100 laptop-margin-10 laptop-column-80 small-align-self-center\">\r\n                    <div class=\"faq-wrapper\">\r\n                        <h2 class=\"title color-onyx\">Read the podcast!<\/h2>\r\n                                                    <div class=\"faq-container\">\r\n                                                                    <div class=\"responsiville-accordion\">\r\n                                        <div class=\"responsiville-accordion-panel\">\r\n                                            <div class=\"responsiville-accordion-header color-onyx\">\r\n                                                WHEN On Topic- Episode 2 | What does it mean to care - and why doesn\u2019t it \u201cfit\u201d in our work?\u00a0                                            <\/div>\r\n                                            <div class=\"responsiville-accordion-content\">\r\n                                                <div class=\"text\">\r\n                                                    \n<div class=\"text\">\n    <p><b>Introduction:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Welcome to the new season of WHEN On Topic! I&#8217;m Pinelopi Theodorakakou, and yes, you&#8217;re not mistaken \u2013 our podcast has a new name, as does our organisation. Women on Top is now WHEN; but it continues, just as before, to invest in the professional and economic empowerment of women and in workplace equality, and often, beyond it. This podcast season, for example, is dedicated to caregiving responsibilities and their equal distribution, and it comes to you thanks to CAREdiZO. What is CAREdiZO? It\u2019s a new project we are participating in under the CERV programme of the European Commission. Its aim is to bridge the gender gap in caregiving responsibilities by promoting equality-driven practices at home, in very small businesses, and in small civil society organisations with up to 10 employees. The project supports family-friendly policies, encourages men to participate\u00a0 in caregiving, and highlights the value of care in society- values we, too, have long been advocating for. Its actions include research, co-creation workshops, training programs, and the development of digital tools, such as an educational game, and podcasts like the one you\u2019re listening to now, all designed to combat stereotypes and promote equality. Our partners come from Cyprus, Lithuania, and Bulgaria, and are currently creating their own podcast episodes, which you may\u00a0 have the opportunity to discover soon. The second episode of this season is, unsurprisingly, dedicated to care. So, we\u2019re talking with Dimitra Gounari, PCI parent coach and parent educator, about what it really means to care, why care doesn\u2019t quite \u201cfit\u201d, in quotes, into our work, and what needs to happen for a team or a company to truly embed a culture of care into the way it operates.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Dimitra, welcome to WHEN on Topic.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Good evening, thank you so much for having me here today.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Would you like to tell us in a few words about yourself?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes, of course. As you mentioned, I\u2019m a PCI Parent Coach, which means I support and empower parents. Alongside that, since 2021, I\u2019ve been providing support services for working parents within the workplace. And over the past two years or so, that has evolved from parental support to supporting individuals with caregiving responsibilities in the workplace more broadly. Essentially, through proposals, workshops, training sessions, and talks, I aim to help workplaces become more inclusive of people with caregiving responsibilities.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: That\u2019s great. Thank you so much for that mini-introduction. I\u2019ll come back toward the end of our conversation to ask what we can actually do in work environments when it comes to care. But first, I\u2019d like to ask: when you hear the word care, what\u2019s the first thing that comes to your mind?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: These days? Because, to be honest, and this has changed over time for me, especially as I\u2019ve been working in the field and interacting with caregivers, it\u2019s definitely evolved. But what I\u2019ve come to understand over time is that care carries responsibility. It also brings exhaustion, and it also includes solidarity. So, there\u2019s a positive element too. On the one hand, there\u2019s responsibility, which I experience as somewhat neutral. Then there\u2019s exhaustion, which has a more negative emotional charge. But the positive element is solidarity.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Can I ask you something? I&#8217;d like to share my perspective on care and ask if you\u2019ve ever thought or felt the same way. Doesn\u2019t care have a strange sense of time to it? What I mean is: we often find ourselves caring for many people at the same time, in completely different situations.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes, it\u2019s nice that you feel that way, I mean, it\u2019s interesting that it resonates with you. And yes, absolutely. It has a lot to do with how we relate to and interact with the people in our lives throughout it. And maybe that\u2019s what creates this experience of time, the sense that with the same people, in the same roles, as time goes by, we are both giving and receiving care. So, we may be caregivers, but we might also be receiving care from these people at other points in our lives. And that\u2019s what makes things so complex and demanding.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Do you remember a moment in your life, or a period, personal or professional, when care was a defining element? Either as something you were experiencing or something you were offering?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes, that\u2019s a great question. I think the role of motherhood is almost synonymous with care. For me personally, the first period after my son was born, when I had two children, stands out. When I gave birth to my son, I was working in the private sector. I wasn\u2019t doing what I do now. I was in a different work environment, one that didn\u2019t allow for flexibility. My physical presence was required much more, so the fact that I needed to care for my child at the same time was quite demanding. I remember that time vividly, with all the difficulties that this kind of care brings. Of course, I should say here that this is why the maternal role, precisely because it\u2019s so closely tied to care, often leads us to overlook how difficult it actually is for parents to carry caregiving responsibilities while also working. So that was one period. Another one, which I\u2019ve experienced more recently, was earlier this school year, at the end of the previous one, when my father had to undergo surgery. So I had to step in and support in various ways. My mother is his main caregiver, but there\u2019s also all the additional stuff around that, which for many people is included in daily life, like transportation, emotional support, and so on. And at the same time, I had my own kids, not just one, but two. That made it even harder. There were many caregiving responsibilities occurring simultaneously for different individuals.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: And you&#8217;re highlighting an important point; well, there are so many things we don\u2019t talk about when it comes to care, and that\u2019s actually my next question, but you&#8217;re also pointing to something even more invisible: caring for the caregivers. For instance, what you said about your mother, someone may be the primary caregiver for another person, but that person also has needs that require care. And because their time and energy are tied up, even temporarily, whether for a long or short period, someone else needs to take care of the \u201csurrounding tasks,\u201d as you called them. And I want us to stay with that for a moment: why do you think, based on your experience, both in supporting parents and in the workplaces you\u2019ve been a part of, either as an employee or as a coach or trainer, why does care continue to remain invisible in so many of the spaces where we spend so many hours of our lives?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes. For me, perhaps the most important thing is that this conversation is only just beginning in Greece, and very slowly at that. Even abroad, care is so deeply embedded in our very being, especially when it comes to women. The stereotype of the \u201cwoman-mother who cares,\u201d who is always there and will always be there to provide, as if it&#8217;s an essential part of her existence, makes it really hard to name this as a difficulty, to name it as a separate responsibility. And this makes it so much harder for us to advocate for something better or for measures that could make our path easier. Let me give you an example: every time I run a care awareness workshop, the most important moment is right at the beginning, when we ask, \u201cDo you have caregiving responsibilities?\u201d The first reaction is usually \u201cNo.\u201d I think the only thing people tend to identify quickly, if you just ask \u201cDo you have care responsibilities?\u201d, is the role of parenting. But once I start giving other examples, \u201cHas this ever happened to you?\u201d or \u201cHave there been times when\u2026\u201d, then slowly, everyone participating realises that at some point in their life, or even at that moment, they do have care responsibilities. So, I think the first difficulty in doing anything about this is just recognising it. We don\u2019t have it registered in our minds as such. I also want to say this: there\u2019s an argument I often hear, and I understand it to an extent, that \u201cIf we talk about everything this way, we lose a bit of our humanity.\u201d Many people have said to me: \u201cBut isn\u2019t that just part of being human?\u201d And yes, it is part of our humanity. Yes, we absolutely don\u2019t want to lose that. Yes, support networks and solidarity are incredibly important. But what we\u2019re missing, and what I\u2019m really trying to work toward, is ensuring that this deeply human and beautiful element doesn\u2019t become an obstacle to work, to financial independence, to our dreams, to hope, or to our mental health.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Dimitra, in relation to what you just said, so there\u2019s a kind of taboo around talking about the needs we have as people with caregiving responsibilities. Like, if I care for someone, there must automatically be some element of self-sacrifice involved. Otherwise, I\u2019m somehow not human enough. I don\u2019t know.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes, Pinelopi, that\u2019s exactly right. It\u2019s very present, and it\u2019s especially strong in parenting. I think we\u2019ve all heard the phrase, \u201cWell, they\u2019re your kids, you chose to have them, why are you complaining?\u201d This goes for both mothers and fathers. And something else, which I think is extremely important, and which needs a lot more attention in Greece, and this podcast is a great opportunity to shine a light on it, is the care provided for older adults: our parents, our siblings, women toward their spouses, which is the most common case (though of course the opposite exists too). In those situations, it\u2019s like caregiving must always be, let me put it this way, \u201cfrom the heart,\u201d and we must always be happy to offer help. But, that\u2019s incredibly hard for the person who is providing the care. Because this emotional expectation is tied to the caregiving role, either one they\u2019ve chosen or simply found themselves in, that expectation puts a huge burden on them. As a result, they often don\u2019t ask for help, and they end up emotionally crushed. And they face a lot of challenges, financial, physical, psychological, and so on.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: And emotional, yes, what you said, this emotional crushing. That \u201ccare\u201d equals something self-evident, \u201ccare\u201d equals self-sacrifice, no matter who I\u2019m providing care for. Whether I chose to have kids, so \u201cwhy complain,\u201d or I\u2019m caring for an aging parent, who once cared for me, then it\u2019s my \u201crole\u201d to do it, and to do it with a smile, with joy, with patience, and with self-sacrifice. And I wonder if this assumption of self-sacrifice, this social expectation, as you beautifully put it, especially when directed toward people who once cared for us in the past. I wonder if that assumption is actually a key barrier to integrating care, to bring it back to the workplace, workplace policies, and the everyday practices of organisations. And let\u2019s note here that because CAREdiZO is a program focused on small businesses and small organisations, I\u2019d like us to focus a bit on those types of environments.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: First of all, yes, I believe this is one of the main obstacles. That\u2019s why I\u2019d say, quite quickly, that perhaps the first policy strategy any business, regardless of size, could adopt in order to introduce a care-focused philosophy is simply to talk about caregiving responsibilities. To define what it means to be an informal caregiver. To identify whether we ourselves are, or have been, or might one day become one. Because in many cases, it\u2019s quite obvious that it will happen at some point. And when I say \u201cobvious,\u201d I mean that we know more or less our own ages, we know that our parents, for example, might begin to experience health issues. So, understanding where I stand, now, in the past, and potentially in the future, is incredibly helpful. When we use that kind of language, like saying, \u201cAre you an informal caregiver?\u201d, then we open the door to the next questions, which are: \u201cWhat are your needs? What are these care responsibilities?\u201d Because, as you know, this doesn\u2019t look the same for everyone. Care responsibilities might be medical, for instance, I have to give the injections, or I have to hand out my parent\u2019s medication. Or they might be daily and practical, like transportation, grocery shopping, doing tasks around the house or the yard, fixing the lights, keeping an eye on all kinds of things. And then there\u2019s emotional support. Especially when caring for someone with Alzheimer\u2019s, this is extremely important. If you ask people who have cared for a parent with Alzheimer\u2019s, a huge part of that care is just being there, talking with them, spending time, engaging. So, care responsibilities vary, and every responsibility has a specific impact on me. That means I have specific needs in my workplace. And it\u2019s really helpful for this to happen openly. For there to be open conversations. For employers to be aware of this and to ask about it in this way. And for employees themselves to be able to see themselves through that lens, to recognise that caregiving is part of their identity and life, and something that needs to be supported at work.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: I\u2019d say you just very nicely outlined five steps, which we\u2019ll come back to a bit later, probably as we close the episode. But first, I want to return to something you said earlier, about time. Spending time with the person I care for is also an invisible side of care. You outlined three dimensions earlier: First, providing practical care, giving injections, handling medications, driving someone around, and so on. Second, taking care of everything around that, grocery shopping, maintaining the house, running errands, going to public services, transport, all that. And third, just being there. Spending time. Without \u201cdoing anything\u201d, in huge quotation marks. Just being there. And I wonder, because one of the main goals of CAREdiZO is to explore and encourage men\u2019s\u00a0 participationin caregiving, how could strengthening men\u2019s involvement in caregiving affect family dynamics (regardless of what form the family takes), and also have an impact in workplaces?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: This is one of the most important issues. Their role is extremely important, and the entire effort to get men to take on a more active role in these responsibilities is crucial. To begin with, women dominate all the statistics. They are far more likely to find themselves in caregiving roles, especially after age 40. If we think of informal care as one big basket, informal caregivers, about 70% are women. And the majority of those are women over 50. Which, of course, has major implications for their mental health. A large segment is women who care for their husbands, and they are often over 65 years old themselves. That\u2019s also very common. Now, this leads to two major outcomes: Women are more likely to retire early or reduce their work hours because of caregiving. This brings serious economic consequences, for example, if someone begins caregiving at 45 or 50, they\u2019ll later have fewer resources when they themselves are in need of care. And that\u2019s really the cycle of care in people\u2019s lives. What I\u2019m trying to say is, if we don\u2019t act now, in 30 years or so, we\u2019re going to be facing enormous caregiving needs. And since the demographics around aging are not looking favorable in Greece (or in many countries), this raises major concerns about whether we\u2019ll be able to meet long-term care needs. But let me return to your question; sorry for the detour.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: No, no, not at all. It\u2019s relevant. Because essentially, what we\u2019re saying is that women cannot continue to be the only ones providing care. Even if we wanted to keep doing it, it\u2019s just not feasible anymore.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Exactly. It puts women at a disadvantage. So, men taking on care responsibilities can absolutely lead to more equal distribution. That, in turn, makes this whole system of informal, long-term care more sustainable and effective. And I think there\u2019s an enormous opportunity for men to take on roles they may have never imagined themselves in, whether we look at this through the lens of stereotypes or not. Because in my view, there\u2019s nothing men can\u2019t do when it comes to the caregiving roles women typically hold. And in the workplace, this might actually be the key that unlocks the conversation more quickly and easily. Meaning, if men start talking about or allowing themselves to openly express their caregiving responsibilities, I think it will greatly benefit women as well, giving them more space to talk and demand real change in the workplace. So yes, it\u2019s extremely important.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: So essentially, what we\u2019re saying is that this is no longer a luxury or a personal choice. Of course, encouraging equal participation in caregiving is the right thing to do, but beyond that, it\u2019s becoming a necessity.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes, it\u2019s definitely a necessity. It\u2019s a necessity because social policy for long-term care is not currently receiving the level of investment that would allow us to say with confidence that, in the coming years, we\u2019ll have the infrastructure or state-supported services to meet the need. Unfortunately. So this caregiving burden will continue to grow, everywhere, not just in Greece. It\u2019s a global trend. And it\u2019s becoming a workplace issue, too, because we\u2019re losing parts of the workforce. Think about it: someone who is 45\u201350 years old, whether a woman or a man, has already made progress in their career. They\u2019re part of the human capital we want to retain. But, if they\u2019re forced to step back due to caregiving responsibilities, which we know are likely at that age, and then you can\u2019t easily replace them, that becomes a serious issue for employers. It\u2019s no coincidence that this entire conversation often starts in workplaces. Employers are increasingly bringing this issue to the forefront, realising that we need to support the people who provide care to retain the talent we want in our organisations.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Do you think small organisations or small businesses might actually have more flexibility to foster a care-centered culture? Precisely because they are small, they have tight-knit, adaptable teams, and they can open up these conversations more easily. The groups are smaller, so it may take fewer resources to implement changes. Or, is it the opposite? That is because they are small, and things already run in a more informal way, they believe they\u2019re already \u201ctaking care\u201d of each other, so there\u2019s no need for formal support? So maybe it\u2019s harder for them?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: I think small and medium enterprises come in all shapes and sizes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: When we say \u201csmall organisations\u201d or \u201csmall businesses,\u201d we mean up to about ten people.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Okay. Well, I think these are workplaces that probably wouldn\u2019t even be able to function, or wouldn\u2019t have lasted this long, if they weren\u2019t already acknowledging caregiving responsibilities in some way. So I definitely think the conversation should happen there, and we also need to develop practical frameworks for those businesses to protect employees with caregiving responsibilities, and to promote structured care policies. Of course, that should happen; it would benefit everyone involved. But I believe these businesses are already doing it, informally, and that actually makes the path forward even easier. In fact, it may be more effective, and perhaps easier, for such a business to simply ask: \u201cWhat are we already doing to support staff with caregiving responsibilities?\u201d, after first explaining what caregiving responsibilities actually entail. So it\u2019s about building on what\u2019s already happening, and that, in my view, is a very positive starting point for the organisation.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: I\u2019ll say here, though, that even if they are doing it, as you said, they\u2019re doing it informally. That is, in most small businesses or small organisations, and I would even say in larger ones, though we\u2019re focusing on the small, there are no official policies that recognise me as an informal caregiver, or that offer me any kind of flexibility or support I might need, if not now, then certainly in the future. And I think this is exactly where the problem lies: It\u2019s all happening informally. And what does \u201cinformal\u201d mean? It means it\u2019s easily changeable, depending on needs, but usually those of the business, not the employee. So I\u2019ll push back a little on what you said earlier, about whether or not these things are already happening.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: I completely agree with you. That\u2019s exactly right, it happens informally. And not just in small organisations; it happens everywhere, which is the problem. I just believe that small businesses might be able to transition more effectively to something formal. Because they\u2019re already doing it in some way, they could more easily formalise it. The real difficulty, I think, lies more in the nature of small businesses, not in caregiving itself or the cost it imposes on day-to-day operations. It\u2019s more about their resistance to formalising things; that\u2019s often just how small businesses operate. And of course, Pinelopi, I completely agree, it\u2019s not enough to leave it up to personal discretion. It shouldn\u2019t be up to me, for example, to decide whether to give you leave because your father needs you, or your kids called from school and they\u2019re sick. That shouldn\u2019t be my decision alone. Because that\u2019s not a policy; that\u2019s just us relying on \u201cgoodwill\u201d or informal arrangements. And that\u2019s not enough. Of course, for a small business to function, this more \u201cfamily-like\u201d atmosphere has helped build an informal support network. But what we\u2019re saying is: If we could formalise that, if we could turn it into clear procedures, then maybe it\u2019s actually easier to do so in workplaces where it\u2019s already happening informally. I\u2019m not sure if I said that clearly.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Very clear, no worries. Earlier, you mentioned some practical steps a team or a business could take to integrate this culture of care that we\u2019re talking about. Here\u2019s what I took away, four main steps: Start talking about care. Clarify and discuss the concepts around care; what does \u201ccare\u201d mean? What\u2019s an informal caregiver? Understand where we stand, as individuals or as a team, in the \u201ccare cycle.\u201d Are we in the thick of it? Just before it? Just after? All of the above? Start planning for prevention, recognising what needs are coming (and they will come), especially for people with less power or more responsibilities. So to do that, we need a needs assessment before any kind of prevention planning. Only then can we create or strengthen any care-related policies we already have (if any). That\u2019s what I\u2019ve taken from our talk: Talk, define the terms, assess needs, know where we are, and plan for prevention.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: You said it beautifully.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: We said it well. Well, you said it, really. If you could change just one policy in an organisation, just one practical step that could bring immediate results and be the starting point, what would that policy be?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Mind if I say one and a half?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: No, not at all. Go ahead, say one and a half.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: I\u2019ll keep it very practical because I know you like that a lot.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: I really, really do.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: In every document where the employee is recorded, could be the onboarding form, an evaluation questionnaire for a workshop, anything, any document that shows the employee\u2019s details, I would add a blank line that says: \u2018If you are, have been, or may be responsible for caregiving.\u2019 And that\u2019s the one. This would create an important change, because someone might see that question and reflect: \u2018What do they mean here?\u2019 The other \u2018half\u2019 is that I would definitely recommend having\u00a0 talks and training workshops for managers and employers in small businesses so that they are informed about what it means to be an informal caregiver.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: I think you just stole the show, because that \u2018half\u2019 is actually a huge step! So to recap: the first step is a simple question: \u2018Are you, have you been, or might you be responsible for caregiving?\u2019 This means making the role visible and making visible those with caregiving responsibilities. Then, the next step, which is not half but a whole one, is a talk or workshop. A way to turn that question into a real discussion. Am I saying this right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Yes, yes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Finally, this is a personal question for you, and I hope it will help others too, If you could send a message to people with caregiving responsibilities who feel guilty because they think they\u2019re caring too much, and so they\u2019re leaving other things behind, or that they\u2019re caring not enough, and so they feel bad about it, what would that message be? Let\u2019s close with that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: That what you\u2019re doing is incredibly hard. That we thank you, even those of us who don\u2019t directly receive your care, but know that you participate in a very important network. And that it\u2019s okay to feel whatever you feel, negative, positive, pride, exhaustion. Maybe I would also ask: \u201cDo you need anything?\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Perfect. Dimitra, thank you so much for your time and for all the important things we discussed. We\u2019ll talk again about caregiving responsibilities and everything else.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: Of course. Thank you!<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Dimitra, where can people find you?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Dimitra<\/strong>: You can find me on social media. I post often, so you can follow me to stay updated about talks, workshops, and wherever else we might meet.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Pinelopi<\/strong>: Perfect. Thank you so, so much. Take care!<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"><strong>Closing<\/strong>: How did you find today\u2019s conversation with Dimitra? What else do you think CAREdiZO can bring us to take one step closer to equality at work and beyond? We\u2019re here to read your comments, suggestions, and ideas. Follow us on social media, send us an email, leave us a review on Spotify, come meet us at WHEN Hub, and let\u2019s keep the conversation going to make WHEN and CAREdiZO even better for everyone.<\/span><\/p>\n<\/div>                                                <\/div>\r\n                                            <\/div>\r\n                                        <\/div>\r\n                                    <\/div>\r\n                                                            <\/div>\r\n                                                                    <\/div>\r\n                <\/div>\r\n                    <\/div>\r\n    <\/div>\r\n<\/section>\n\n\n<div class=\"text\">\n    <p style=\"text-align: center;\"><b>The WHEN on Topic Podcast is available on all major platforms!<\/b><\/p>\n<p style=\"text-align: center;\">You can listen to all episodes on any platform you listen to your podcasts on \u2013 we are on\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/09iNBpLA8e3zfkAMZBVqyi\"><b>Spotify<\/b><\/a>,\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/1924253\/listings\/3126301\/edit\"><b>Buzzsprout<\/b><\/a>,\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.google.com\/feed\/aHR0cDovL2ZlZWRzLmxpYnN5bi5jb20vMjQzNDEzL3Jzcw?hl=en-GR\"><b>Google podcasts<\/b><\/a>\u00a0&amp;\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/podcast\/id1496502155\"><b>Apple podcasts<\/b><\/a>,\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/www.audible.com\/pd\/Women-On-Topic-Podcast\/B09VG1JD3R?\"><b>Amazon music<\/b><\/a>,\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/pca.st\/5qc63x16\"><b>Pocket Casts<\/b><\/a>,\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/podcastaddict.com\/podcast\/3795610\"><b>Podcast Addict<\/b><\/a>, and of course on\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/blacklemon.tv\/podcasts\/women-topic\/\"><b>Black Lemon<\/b><\/a>\u2019s platform.<\/p>\n<hr \/>\n<p style=\"text-align: center;\">The\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/caredizo.eu\/\"><b>CAREdiZO<\/b><\/a>\u00a0project is implemented in the framework of the European Commission\u2019s CERV Programme, as a cooperation among the\u00a0 following organisations: Challedu (Greece), WHEN (Greece), MOTERU INFORMACIJOS CENTRAS (Lithuania), NATSIONALNA MREZHA ZA BIZNES RAZVITIE (Bulgaria), Mediterranean Institute of Gender Studies (Cyprus). The project is funded by the European Union. The views and opinions expressed are, nonetheless, solely those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect those of the European Commission-EU. Neither the European Union nor the European Commission is responsible for them. Project code: 101191047 \u2013 CAREdiZO \u2013 CERV-2024-GE.<\/p>\n<\/div>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>What does it mean to care - and why doesn\u2019t it \u201cfit\u201d in our work?<\/p>\n<p>This podcast episode is dedicated to care - a word with many different meanings, especially when it comes to work and daily life. How does the unequal distribution of caregiving responsibilities affect the lives of caregivers? What does it mean for women to be consistently present in the role of informal caregivers, and what is the role of men in this landscape?\u00a0<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":17,"featured_media":37481,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[385,460],"tags":[442],"class_list":["post-37480","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-nea-en","category-when-on-topic","tag-caredizo-en-2"],"acf":[],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v23.5 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>What does it mean to care - and why doesn\u2019t it \u201cfit\u201d in our work? &#8226; WHEN<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"What does it mean to care - and why doesn\u2019t it \u201cfit\u201d in our work? 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